Return-path: X-Andrew-Authenticated-as: 7997;andrew.cmu.edu;Ted Anderson Received: from hogtown.andrew.cmu.edu via trymail for +dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr11/tm2b/space/space.dl@andrew.cmu.edu (->+dist+/afs/andrew.cmu.edu/usr11/tm2b/space/space.dl) (->ota+space.digests) ID ; Sun, 21 Apr 91 01:37:18 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: Precedence: junk Reply-To: space+@Andrew.CMU.EDU From: space-request+@Andrew.CMU.EDU To: space+@Andrew.CMU.EDU Date: Sun, 21 Apr 91 01:37:12 -0400 (EDT) Subject: SPACE Digest V13 #434 SPACE Digest Volume 13 : Issue 434 Today's Topics: Commercial Space News (2 of 6) MIR SWEEPSTAKES BACK, ALIVE AND WELL!! Commercial Space News (4 of 6) Voyager II Re: I want to go to orbit... Re: Government vs. Commercial R&D Re: Voyager II Administrivia: Submissions to the SPACE Digest/sci.space should be mailed to space+@andrew.cmu.edu. Other mail, esp. [un]subscription requests, should be sent to space-request+@andrew.cmu.edu, or, if urgent, to tm2b+@andrew.cmu.edu ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: 20 Apr 91 06:04:31 GMT From: agate!bionet!uwm.edu!caen!sdd.hp.com!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!zardoz.cpd.com!dhw68k!ofa123!Wales.Larrison@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Wales Larrison) Subject: Commercial Space News (2 of 6) SHENANIGANS OVER DELTA II SRM CONTRACT [I found this rather amusing, and somewhat illustrative of the maneuvering which can occur in commercial space business - even at the subcontractor and supplier levels....] It was recently announced that Hercules had won a $100 M contract for Delta II strap-on solid rocket motors. These SRMs are used to add to the first stage thrust for the McDonnell-Douglas Delta II rocket, which is used for commercial launches. There have been two suppliers for these systems - Thiokol with "Castor" strap-ons, and Hercules with advanced Graphite Epoxy Motors (GEMs). Both systems have been used on the Delta, and both have exemplary reliability records. The GEMs are a little lighter weight due to their advanced composite case, but Thiokol has been developing an equivalent case for their Castor motors. Costs between the two systems are pretty close, from what little data I have been able to gather. The contract, for at least $60 M in orders, could lock up the Delta SRM orders for up to five years. The contract went to Hercules, who got help from the State of Utah - who offered a $10 M loan to McDonnell Douglas Corp (MDC) to expand MD80 and MD90 production at their component manufacturing operations in Utah. (MDC has built components for their commercial airliners at a facility in Utah for years.) The state loan had a kicker in it though, since if MDC would bring $100 M in additional aerospace business to Utah, the loan would not have to be repaid. Since MDC is hurting for cash (due to the A-12 cancellation, huge startup costs for their MD-11 aircraft, possible cost overruns on the fixed price C-17, and problems with other programs), this was a powerful incentive to pick a Utah-based manufacturer. Hercules builds the GEM motors in Bacchus, Utah. Thiokol, while having major production facilities in Utah as well, would build the Castor motors near Huntsville, AL. Hercules won the contract... After Hercules won the contract, Thiokol president Ed Garrison was reportedly somewhat upset the State of Utah would support one Utah firm over another. He was reported to have said Thiokol would be forced to "rethink our commitment to the state". [Commentary: I don't think this article needs a lot of commentary, but it illustrates some of the political and financial shenanigans that can go on with large programs. Thiokol will probably stay in the state - as least as long as they continue to build Shuttle SRMs - since they have a huge investment in facilities there. Hercules played this game very astutely, and the State of Utah got the additional business and industry they wanted to increase their tax base.] -- Wales Larrison Internet: Wales.Larrison@ofa123.fidonet.org Compuserve: >internet:Wales.Larrison@ofa123.fidonet.org -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: 19 Apr 91 08:24:03 GMT From: agate!bionet!ucselx!usc!cs.utexas.edu!swrinde!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!lavaca.uh.edu!jetson.uh.edu!cosc12xv@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU Subject: MIR SWEEPSTAKES BACK, ALIVE AND WELL!! PLEASE POST THIS INFORMATION EVERYWHERE YOU CAN: April 17, 1991 To Everyone: SPACE TRAVEL SERVICES INCORPORATED IS BACK IN BUSINESS! THE ULTIMATE ADVENTURE, WIN A TRIP TO MIR, SWEEPSTAKES HAS RESUMED!! I spoke with one of the officials of SPACE TRAVEL on Tuesday night. I was told that they have received full go ahead to resume operations from their new location, which is not in Houston. They have aquired a new 900 number and are already taking calls. The sweepstakes can still be entered by phone or free by mail. And the grand prize is still a ride on a Soyuz to spend a week in space aboard the Soviet space station Mir. The brand new SPACE TRAVEL ULTIMATE ADVENTURE line is: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1-900-369-SPACE <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< ( 1-900-369-77223 ) <--- last 3 is optional The cost is still $2.99 per call. Multiple entries allowed and do inprove your chances. You can also enter for FREE (well, 29 cents) by mail. I have not been given the new mail entry address, but I will post it as soon as I get it. Everyone who calls will receive a newsletter and your name will be recorded on a roster that will fly in space. Plus, of course, all entries will be eligible for the trip into space. Space Commerce Corporation, which negotiated the contract with NPO Energia of the Soviet Union, has assured them that the Mir trip is still on. Dispite the troubles SPACE TRAVEL has had, all companies, investors, and the soviets have stuck with them and beleive in the project. Everyone that really knows the guys running SPACE TRAVEL knew that they are totally honest, above board, and sincere in their desire to make space open for all. NO legal actions were EVER taken against SPACE TRAVEL SERVICES INCORPORATED, only against individuals. (Charges have never been proven and may never go to court.) The revitalized sweepstakes is now being advertised on STAR TREK: THE NEXT GENERATION, and at other times, in limited areas of the U.S. as well as on some cable TV stations. (No specific cities or stations were mentioned to me.) Another comment that was made was a reference to a PROPOSED FCC regulation of 900 numbers. The FCC is considering requiring ALL 900 services to start with a statement of how much the call will cost and give the caller a chance to hang up without being charged. Many 900 services are fighting this proposal. SPACE TRAVEL, on the other hand, started doing this immediately when they started business in December, before the FCC even announced the proposal. SPACE TRAVEL will continue to follow this practice whether the rule becomes law or not. I realize that there are still questions left unanswered and I will do what I can to get and report the answers as soon as possible. If you have any questions or comments, I will do what I can to pass them on to them and get back with an answer. Do not count on me seeing responses posted where this may wind up being posted. Please send directly to me at my INTERNET Email address. If you received this directly from me and do not want to receive future updates about SPACE TRAVEL SERVICES and the MIR SWEEPSTAKES, please tell me right away so I can delete you from my list. Thank You, Ad Astra, and Ad Mir!!! Alvin Carley Friend of SPACE TRAVEL SERVICES INTERNET ----> COSC12XV@JETSON.UH.EDU (Expires 5-19-91) ------------------------------ Date: 20 Apr 91 06:06:33 GMT From: agate!bionet!uwm.edu!wuarchive!sdd.hp.com!elroy.jpl.nasa.gov!zardoz.cpd.com!dhw68k!ofa123!Wales.Larrison@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Wales Larrison) Subject: Commercial Space News (4 of 6) MCDONNELL-DOUGLAS POSTS OBJECTION TO DOT LAUNCH LICENSE FEES The U.S. Department of Transportation's Office of Commercial Space Transportation (OCST) has recently proposed licensing fees from commercial launch system operators. As proposed, the fees would include an annual fee of $2500 with an additional $2.50/lb of payload capability per launch to Low Earth Orbit (28.5 deg orbit, 150 nmi). As per government regulations, these proposed new fees were placed in public record, and comments were encouraged, with the period for comment ending this week. OCST released the text of a letter from a Alan B. Kehlet, VP at McDonnell Douglas Space Systems Co, which blasted OCST and the proposed fees. A few excerpts... o "We do not consider 'permission to operate' a very compelling benefit from the government... Quite the opposite. The benefit conferred upon our nation and contribution to the economy of our nation by the willingness of the ELV (expendable launch vehicle) industry to undertake such activity, at substantial risk and investment to itself, is in fact a far greater benefit to the country and the public than the proposed service and fees represented by their collection." o [Stating the USAF monitors and controls all Delta launches (USAF and commercial payloads) since they are launched from USAF launch facilities] "If the public interest is considered protected under USAF contracted launch services and the USAF oversees commercial launches, as they do in our case, where is the real value added by the DOT? It appears there is considerable and unnecessary overlap of 'overseer' activity in this area of public safety." o "Current commercial profit margins are negative to low and levying user fees further perturbates a deteriorating condition. It is one more adverse impact to the U.S. launch industry's ability to survive against foreign government subsidized competition." [Commentary: Some prime flame from an unexpected source. I wasn't expecting MDSSC to take such a strong stance against OCST fees for regulation of the ELV industry. Philosophically, I agree with MDSSC, based upon current operating conditions and practices. However, we want to move to more "commercial" operations, which means moving more typical "regulation" by the government, and less oversight. So a transition from day-to-day NASA/DoD oversight of launch operations to regulatory oversight is needed - and OCST is a step in the right direction. But, OCST is pretty much in a bind - Congress has laid a requirement on them to fund their office's cost from the industry they regulate, which means "user fees". However, they are not yet perceived by the industry as the prime regulatory agency for space launches and operations, since the industry deals on a day-to-day basis with NASA and DoD for these same operations at KSC/CCAFS and VAFB. If there were a purely commercial launch facility, the OCST might have a better, more focused, role - such as the FCC does for operations from a commercial airport.] -- Wales Larrison Internet: Wales.Larrison@ofa123.fidonet.org Compuserve: >internet:Wales.Larrison@ofa123.fidonet.org -------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------ Date: 20 Apr 91 01:53:42 GMT From: cruzio!brettb@uunet.uu.net (Brett Breitwieser) Subject: Voyager II Does anyone know if Voyager II is still sending out a signal? My last info was that it was sending out about 20 Watts and was located at Right Ascension 19 hrs and Declination -30.0 degrees just below the elliptic in the constellation Sagittarius, near nu Sagittari, is this still current? And are any amateurs picking it up? Where is the signal being emitted? Somewhere around 8 GHz? V V V V V V Brett Breitwieser V V V V VAJRACOM CONSULTANTS *VAJRA*COM* GRIDLOC CM86XX Santa Cruz, CA V V V V ..uunet!cruzio!brettb V V V V V V SETI: The Ultimate DX ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 20 Apr 91 22:49:09 EDT From: rjkloost <@BITNET.CC.CMU.EDU:rjkloost@THUNDER.LAKEHEADU.CA> sub rjkloost ------------------------------ Date: 18 Apr 91 14:59:16 GMT From: wuarchive!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!unix.cis.pitt.edu!pitt!nss!Paul.Blase@psuvax1.cs.psu.edu (Paul Blase) Subject: Re: I want to go to orbit... to: rivero@dev8a.mdcbbs.com r> Now that we've all had a small chuckle over this gentlemans r> ambitions (You're sailing WHERE, Christopher?), may I ask if r> anyone has seen of or heard from Robert Truax lately. He is the r> ex-NASA rocket scientist who was building his own 1 man orbital r> rocket a few years back. Last I heard, he had the booster r> completed, and was trying to fund the actual vehicle. When I left the Dayton, Ohio area 4 years ago for the DC area a group of people in the Dayton NSS chapter were busy constructing their own liquid fueled rocket engine (small scale). I think that they had actually gotten as far as a first test firing. --- via Silver Xpress V2.26 [NR] -- Paul Blase - via FidoNet node 1:129/104 UUCP: ...!pitt!nss!Paul.Blase INTERNET: Paul.Blase@nss.FIDONET.ORG ------------------------------ Date: 20 Apr 91 15:16:28 GMT From: agate!bionet!ucselx!usc!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!maverick.ksu.ksu.edu!ux1.cso.uiuc.edu!usenet@ucbvax.Berkeley.EDU (Doug McDonald) Subject: Re: Government vs. Commercial R&D In article <330.28100E11@nss.FIDONET.ORG> Paul.Blase@nss.FIDONET.ORG (Paul Blase) writes: > >Please don't forget that I was distinguishing between basic research and the >application of that research to a usable product. BTW, why shouldn't >government agencies direct research? The government agencies should not direct research (I mean here real research, not disguised development) because they are incompetant to do so. The only group known to be less competant are politicians. The better funding agencies - (parts of) NSF, (parts of) NIH, and (parts of) AFOSR - rely on peer reviews for their decisions. They do a pretty good job of choosing things to fund. The parts that fund things based on internal decisions alone produce less quality, and agencies like NASA that are almost wholly political need miracles to make good choices. Doug MCDonald ------------------------------ Date: 21 Apr 91 02:15:35 GMT From: usc!sdd.hp.com!zaphod.mps.ohio-state.edu!rpi!news-server.csri.toronto.edu!utzoo!henry@ucsd.edu (Henry Spencer) Subject: Re: Voyager II In article <2700@cruzio.cruzio.UUCP> brettb@cruzio.UUCP (Brett Breitwieser) writes: >Does anyone know if Voyager II is still sending out a signal? >... And are any amateurs picking it up? ... Voyager 2 is still active and sending, but considering that its transmitter power is a few tens of watts at a distance of circa five billion km, I'd be surprised to see an amateur setup able to detect it. -- And the bean-counter replied, | Henry Spencer @ U of Toronto Zoology "beans are more important". | henry@zoo.toronto.edu utzoo!henry ------------------------------ End of SPACE Digest V13 #434 *******************