========================================================================= (C) 1993 by Atari Corporation, GEnie, and the Atari Roundtables. May be reprinted only with this notice intact. The Atari Roundtables on GEnie are *official* information services of Atari Corporation. To sign up for GEnie service, call (with modem) 800-638-8369. Upon connection type HHH (RETURN after that). Wait for the U#= prompt.Type XTX99437,GENIE and press [RETURN]. The system will prompt you for your information. ========================================================================== Category 14, Topic 35 Message 1 Thu Jul 15, 1993 C.OATES2 [Chris] at 02:24 EDT I suppose this is the proper place to ask: What exaclty is font "hinting"? ~Chris ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 2 Thu Jul 15, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 07:15 EDT My Egghead store says the special on the Speedo compatible Word Perfect fonts runs until 7/24. I told the guy why I was interested, and he was surprised. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 3 Thu Jul 15, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 07:37 EDT Chris, Font hinting is a mathematically derived reshaping of the characters at different sizes, so that characters that are scaled quite small still look readable on the screen and on the printer. That's about as simple as I can make it. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 4 Thu Jul 15, 1993 K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 14:12 EDT So is there going to be a bitmap to speedo converter? Nobody mentioned that bootup would take this as long as it does, either. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 5 Thu Jul 15, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 18:01 EDT Ken Van, Ain't no Egghead stores here. Would you be willing to pick one of those specials up for me if I send you the cash plus $5? Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 6 Thu Jul 15, 1993 C.S.SMETON [STraight FAX] at 18:44 EDT To: A.FASOLDT, Egghead has an 800 number (1-800-EGG-HEAD). Better yet call your Atari dealer and ask them to carry this font package. To: K.ESTES, I doubt that there would ever be a bitmap to Speedo converter. First of the quality of most bit map fonts is not that great compared to scalable font technologies such as Speedo, Adobe Type 1 and True Type. Second, Bitstream has not made their Speedo format public yet. Finally, The purpose of Speedo GDOS is to do the exact opposite -- rasterize a scalable font outline equation into a bit map at any point size for any device. Charles ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 7 Thu Jul 15, 1993 K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 20:34 EDT Ah... just the person! Speedo shows up as FSM GDOS in STRAIGHT FAX. I just faxed my registration data to NewStar. What's the story? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 8 Thu Jul 15, 1993 BRIAN.H [ST~SysOp] at 21:22 EDT I am confused. Why convert bitmap fonts when isn't that what the bitmap font cache is for? (To use bitmap fonts.) ~~~~Brian ... Written on Thursday 15 July 1993 at 09:48 p.m. ADT ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 9 Thu Jul 15, 1993 EXPLORER.5 [Robert Goff] at 21:44 EDT Won't SpeedoGDOS handle GEM format bitmap fonts? And if so, wouldn't it be best to use one of them for Stalker? |) | |)O|) Robert Goff ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 10 Thu Jul 15, 1993 C.S.SMETON [STraight FAX] at 23:06 EDT To: K.ESTES, FSM GDOS was supposed to be the version of GDOS that supported scalable fonts. However (and it appears that this has been for the better of the user base), FSM was replaced by Speedo GDOS. To maintain compatibility with programs that were enhanced to support FSM GDOS, Speedo GDOS returned the same signature as FSM GDOS. The version of STraight FAX! that you are using must not be the current (v1.07) release. Version 1.07 was updated to recognize the additional signature that distinguishes between FSM and Speedo. Versions 1.06 and below were released before developers had Speedo GDOS, so it does not know anything about Speedo. You can get the update to 1.07. Please check out Cat 4, Topic 24 for details. Thanks Charles @ NewSTar ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 11 Fri Jul 16, 1993 K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 03:53 EDT Thanks, Charles. I plan to upgrade to a later version. And I plan to upgrade my roms too. How _do_ I use bitmapped fonts with Speedo? Remember, I H-A-T-E ASSIGN.SYS files. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 12 Fri Jul 16, 1993 D.MCNAMEE [Dan @ Atari] at 16:31 EST Kenne, Speedo will use the bitmap fonts you already have. You just keep them in your ASSIGN.SYS like you always did. Boot up taking a long time? I haven't noticed and boot delays. Dan ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 13 Fri Jul 16, 1993 BRIAN.H [ST~SysOp] at 19:18 EDT Kenne, Re: bootup. What is the size of your caches? ~~~~Brian ... Written on Friday 16 July 1993 at 07:51 p.m. ADT ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 14 Fri Jul 16, 1993 K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 20:54 EDT The three caches are around 60-50 k each. Did someone say "assign.sys?" Slowly I turned, step by step, inch by inch.... ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 15 Fri Jul 16, 1993 AEO.7 [Gregg] at 21:05 EDT RE.... boot delays, Are the FontWidth Tables 'on'? Of so then turn them off. This feature is used ONLY for a handful of programs (EasyDraw (not really needed there), TimeWorks DTP, and I don't know of any others) to improve font speed withing them. This DOES result in greatly extended boot times for the system and most especially for the GDOS program itself... In other words... don't ever leave your Font Width Table active unless you have no other choice. Gregg (who still had to learn the hard way even after everyone here told him not to try it ) ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 16 Fri Jul 16, 1993 C.OATES2 [Chris] at 21:14 EDT Well with FSM and the CPXs, there was a way with the printer setup CPX to add bitmap fonts exacly the same way as adding the outline fonts, but I can't find anything as such with the Speedo ACCs. ~Chris ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 17 Fri Jul 16, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 22:24 EDT Dan, In demos I've seen, the delay was not in the bootup but in the running of AW. Bootup was fast, Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 18 Fri Jul 16, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 22:42 EDT Al, Sure, but I won't do it for just anybody who comes along. I'm planning to get mine on 7/23, unless I get a chance to sooner. It's on the other side of town. I'll call and see if they will hold two for me. My address is 1018 Nottingham Rd., Grosse Pointe Park, MI 48230-1332. I think Charles mentioned the special in the STraight FAX topic, and I responded here by mistake. I like his idea to have the Atari dealer get it, but if you can't wait for your dealer, you might try Charles' suggestion. My store said they would ship for $5, which would be about the same as their regular price (without the special). Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 19 Sat Jul 17, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 19:58 EDT Ken, I'm sending you cash (in double envelope) in the next mail. Thanks *very* much. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 20 Sun Jul 18, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 00:35 EDT Al, When I didn't hear from you, I thought you might have decided to use the 800 number and mail order. I found that my local store will ship for $5, which brings the package to the price it would be without the sale, but still a very good deal. If I get your money, I guess I'll _have to_ go to the store. :^) BTW, have you seen TOAD's ad? That's a pretty good deal, too. I don't know what fonts are in the Word Perfect package. We'll have to see. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 21 Sun Jul 18, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 02:56 EDT Ken, I mailed the dough to you already. I'm fast. :) Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 22 Sun Jul 18, 1993 R.WILSON36 [Bob Wilson] at 11:01 EDT Ken Egg Head will not ship to canada so you may get a few requests from the great white north. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 23 Sun Jul 18, 1993 A.MASON4 [Anna] at 15:53 EDT I called my Egghead store this morning and the Bitstream WP 6.0 font disk is on sale until the 28th! Looks like it depends on either the store or area. Anna ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 24 Sun Jul 18, 1993 FAIRWEATHER [David] at 19:10 EDT Please recap the Egghead discount details for me. Is this a Macintosh package of Fonts? If so do the fonts have to be transverted off a Mac formatted disk onto an ST/IBM formatted disk? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 25 Sun Jul 18, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 20:02 EDT Al, Well, I guess I won't bother to do a mail order for mine, then. :^) You understand it won't go out until next week sometime. UPS. Bob, Only for special friends. I think I know you. ;^) Anna, I thought I said 28. I deal with millions and billions of years, so once in a while when I'm off by a digit or two it doesn't matter much. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 26 Sun Jul 18, 1993 R.NELSON48 [Grouch (:{] at 22:06 EDT I bought the EGGhead pack and it is a winner. 50 speedo fonts for less than 50 cents each. Loading into Atari Works is a real easy task, no more ASSIGN.SYS blues. You do have to run outline.prg (see pg. 3 of Speedo Guide) to install the fonts, and if you install them all it will noticeably slow the AtariWorks program load time. But wat a plethora of print styles. 50 fonts is probably about 40 more than anyone really needs. A BEST buy. I hartily recommend it. And thats from (:{ The Grouch! ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 27 Sun Jul 18, 1993 D.FREELAND [SAXMAN] at 23:43 EDT How does one get the EGGhead pack? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 28 Mon Jul 19, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 07:01 EDT Grouch, So that means about $2.50 each for the ones you use. :^) Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 29 Mon Jul 19, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 07:10 EDT Thanks, Grouch. That's an amazing price, and Ken was kind enough to agree to pick mine up when he gets his. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 30 Mon Jul 19, 1993 K.CAVAGHAN2 [OakSprings] at 07:30 EDT >R.WILSON36 [Bob Wilson] at 11:01 EDT >Ken Egg Head will not ship to canada so you may get a few requests >from the great white north. Strange, Egg Head Software has a warehouse here in Vancouver B.C., as well as 1 or 2 stores, so I imagine that they could ship here if they want. FWIW, Kent ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 31 Mon Jul 19, 1993 R.WILSON36 [Bob Wilson] at 18:27 EDT Kent, You can order from the BC stores (don't know if the special exists) but the 1 800 number does not deliver to Canada. Admitedly very strange. They gave me the Vancouver store number but I haven't called it yet. I figure that eventually some Toronto PC store will have the font pack and I will just pick it up. For now the SPEEDO starter kit from COMPO serves my limited purposes. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 32 Mon Jul 19, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 18:31 EDT Hi, Kent! Long time no "see"! Does their 800 number work up there, too? If it does, that would be an easy way to find out what's what. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 33 Mon Jul 19, 1993 D.MCNAMEE [Dan @ Atari] at 19:58 EST Al, There is some slow down when you run a GDOS program because it has to load the fonts, but this only happens the first time, after that the cache is loaded, and everything runs much faster. Also, I have over 250 fonts on one of my systems for testing, and when I do something with all of the fonts loaded, I don't think it takes too long, and I'm a VERY impatient person. ;-) Dan ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 34 Mon Jul 19, 1993 AEO.7 [Gregg] at 20:22 EDT Pity there's no EggHead Software near Asheville that I know of... Gregg ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 35 Mon Jul 19, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 23:10 EDT Bob, I'm not familiar with the procedure for shipping to Canada, but I would be happy to pick up a pack for you if you'll let me ask some more dumb questions about B/STAT. I'll accept a Gift of Time or whatever. Let me know soon. I plan to stop on Friday. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 36 Tue Jul 20, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 00:33 EDT Thanks, Dan. 250, eh? What's a matta w'you, pal; can't you settle on Times and Helvetica? :) Al (I have 200+ on my PC. It's a disease!) ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 37 Tue Jul 20, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 05:28 EDT Ken, Seems I remember someone saying that if you ship floppy disk to Canada, just put the value of the disk and not the value of the program. This will cut down on the cost of whatever tax is added. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 38 Tue Jul 20, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 07:18 EDT Al, So do you have a sample sheet handy to help select your fonts? Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 39 Tue Jul 20, 1993 C.OINES1 [Chazz] at 07:41 EDT Gregg, you want me to bring you a set? I'm coming down for the Fest... ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 40 Tue Jul 20, 1993 D.MCNAMEE [Dan @ Atari] at 15:06 EST Al, Actually, I really like Revue. ;-) I hope to someday have a complete collection of all Speedo fonts. You can never have enough fonts. Dan ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 41 Tue Jul 20, 1993 K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 19:45 EDT What would be nice is a CD ROM of all the speedo fonts. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 42 Tue Jul 20, 1993 FAIRWEATHER [David] at 22:10 EDT I bought the WP 6.0 font pak at Egghead today. $19.90 plus tax! The salesman was an idiot. First he insists they're not SPEEDO fonts but TRUETYPE fonts and that Bitstream doesn't make SPEEDO fonts anymore. So I bought the package and opened it right in front of him, and right on the first page of the manual it says they are SPEEDO fonts. "What kind of computer are you going to use these with?" he asks. When I answer "The Atari Falcon, of course" he rolls his eyes and practically holds his nose like I just f**ted or something. Then he says "I guess THAT'S why these fonts are so CHEAP!" like there must be something wrong with them if they work on an Atari. Aaarrrrggghh! ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 43 Tue Jul 20, 1993 BRIAN.H [ST~SysOp] at 22:21 EDT > Seems I remember someone saying that if you ship floppy disk to >Canada, just put the value of the disk and not the value of the >program. This will cut down on the cost of whatever tax is added. The problem is the GST (Goods and Services Tax). The post office charges a $5.00 handling fee and then the 7 % tax. UPS charges $16.50 minimum. Not only that, but it increases the the delivery time by days or even over a week! Under $10.00 is OK. ~~~~Brian ... Written on Tuesday 20 July 1993 at 09:39 p.m. ADT ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 44 Tue Jul 20, 1993 J.WISNIEWSK2 [Jeff - ST'er] at 22:41 EDT >eyes and practically holds his nose like I just f**ted or something. Then he >says "I guess THAT'S why these fonts are so CHEAP!" like there must be >something wrong with them if they work on an Atari. Aaarrrrggghh! I like that, even thou the package says for IBM. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^ JSW ^^^^ ^^^^ ST'er ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Tuesday, July 20, 1993 - 10:25:40 pm ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 45 Tue Jul 20, 1993 AEO.7 [Gregg] at 23:21 EDT Chazz.... how much $$$$ are we talking about for this WP speedo font kit? If it's reasonable (I missed the exact # but it must be reasonable since everyone's excited about it ) then YES!!!!!!! please bring one down and I'll write you a check or something (non-rubber of course). I'll be at the show of course (barring the Flu, Auto wreck, or act of God). And will be looking forward to seeing you.... Let me know what the $$$ is and I'll say yea/nay tomorrow. Thanks old buddy, now that's a favor! Gregg ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 46 Wed Jul 21, 1993 K.HOUSER [Kevin MQ Def] at 01:51 EDT I just bought the 50 fonts for WP6.0 by BitStream today at EggHead software in Atlanta. I've already installed all 50 of them and they are WAAAAAAAAAY cool. :) Thanks for the tip guys. Good value for $20 & some change including sales tax. --Kevin ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 47 Wed Jul 21, 1993 K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 04:16 EDT You installed 50 fonts? You have a 128 meg Ram machine? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 48 Wed Jul 21, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 05:34 EDT David, Maybe you ought to do some printouts and take them to him and show him a thing or two. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 49 Wed Jul 21, 1993 C.OINES1 [Chazz] at 07:29 EDT It's about $21 and change for the pack, and an excellent value even after the sale price expires. Then it'll be another $40 or so for gas... ;) ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 50 Wed Jul 21, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 07:43 EDT David, That salesman doesn't sound very PC. (There's a joke there somewhere.) Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 51 Wed Jul 21, 1993 K.HOUSER [Kevin MQ Def] at 07:45 EDT Ken, Ever hear of font caching? Say it slowly... "font ... caching..." There I knew you could. Of course all 50 aren't in ram at the _SAME_ time. They don't need to be either. I actually have around 58 total Speedo fonts installed counting the few I got with my beta. They do take up a bit of hard drive space tho'. Much less than bitmapped fonts since I use 300dpi fonts with my laser. Oops, line length & this crappy "MS Windows terminal" I have to use out here are causing me some agony. --Kevin ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 52 Wed Jul 21, 1993 D.MCNAMEE [Dan @ Atari] at 11:48 EST Kenne, Hey, you don't need that much memory. I have over 250 fonts on a 4 meg Falcon. (yes, all installed at once) Dan ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 53 Wed Jul 21, 1993 K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 13:09 EDT Hmmmm.... ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 54 Wed Jul 21, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 18:46 EDT The sale price is about $5 off. One of the stores in the Detroit area said they would ship UPS for $5, which brought the total back to about the non-sale level. If you're too far away, you might try phoning. The sale price would pay for your shipping. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 55 Wed Jul 21, 1993 J.NOLAN5 [John Nolan] (Forwarded) Forgive me for posting to the wrong area: I can't find an area for SpeedoGDOS support: I just received SpGDOS from Compo, and the instalation prg won't proceed past the point of requesting me to insert Disk-1 in my drive (in spite of the fact that it's already there) Offering another disk, or a copy of disk 1, or the original disk-1 doesn't seem to help... can you? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 56 Wed Jul 21, 1993 AEO.7 [Gregg] at 20:28 EDT Chazz, if you can find me one for the $20 figure then YES... PLEASE BRING ME A SET!!!!! I'll gladly write you a check for that and maybe even a buck or two for the gas to go to your local Egghead to pick it up. As for a discount for the gas getting here to the show.... well, we'll talk about it, but if you're looking to buy a Falcon I may be able to help you find one . Gregg ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 57 Wed Jul 21, 1993 T.HEBEL [Spud Boy] at 20:48 EDT Toad is also seeling a Pack of 50 SPEEDO fonts for arounf $35. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 58 Wed Jul 21, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 21:48 EDT Hey, bring me a set also. I could use it when I buy AtariWorks. :-) ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 59 Wed Jul 21, 1993 C.OATES2 [Chris] at 23:05 EDT I've been having some problems with the WP font pack. First, I install it, but the fonts only show up to about "S" in the list (I've got about 80 fonts bwtween the Compo & WP packs) and none of the text effects work, like Italic or Outline (Actually, underline works) So I go to increase my caches, and it's sooooo slow! I finally bring up the outline .ACC and when I go to scroll the list of fonts, I get "A workstation error has occured. The operation has been cancelled" THinking it was a memory problem, I brought up the control panel, selected "General" (I wanted to see how much free mem I had) and the system bombs! Every time! :( The fonts are neat, and If I remove some of them I can get to the end of the list. Any Ideas? P.S. I'm running this on a 4 Meg MegaSTE withb AtariWorks. ~Chris Update: Now I can't start up if I load Speedo! Three bombs after All Auto Programs load, possibly during the loading of DAs! ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 60 Thu Jul 22, 1993 SAM-RAPP [<>] at 00:11 EDT What fonts are included in this pack? And just how much room do you have in your car Chazz? Maybe Sheldon could arrange to get a few of these font packs to sell at the show? Are these fonts available at this price via bitstreams tool free #? (uh.. does bitstream HAVE a toll free order line?) Questions Questions Questions! ------------> Sam ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 61 Thu Jul 22, 1993 K.HOUSER [Kevin MQ Def] at 01:58 EDT I have no problems with having 58 Speedo fonts loaded (50 from the WP6.0 pkg), BUT I did have to set the misc cache to ~200KBytes (forget the garbage about only 16 to 30 kb required) and the character cache set to ~200Kbytes. Ya need a large character cache if you wanna keep things speeding along. --Kevin ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 62 Thu Jul 22, 1993 B.REHBOCK [Bill@Atari] at 02:20 EDT Dan, I've got you beat with 560 fonts on my TT :-) ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 63 Thu Jul 22, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 03:23 EDT Ken, No. I just use my memory. (!) Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 64 Thu Jul 22, 1993 C.OINES1 [Chazz] at 06:54 EDT Gregg: Fonts is On The Way. What, another Falcon? I haven't worn out the one I've _got_ yet! ;) ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 65 Thu Jul 22, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 07:22 EDT Al, I need all of my memory for other stuff that I use all the time, and have to look up the reference-type stuff. Just wait till you get so old once. ;^) Ken ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 66 Thu Jul 22, 1993 C.OINES1 [Chazz] at 07:23 EDT Sam's questions: A whole bunch of them. A lot of room. I'm not bringing more than one unless I can make an enormous profit on them. I have no idea. Call them at 1-800-522-FONT and find out yerself. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 67 Thu Jul 22, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 08:05 EDT Kenne, You can have hundreds of fonts installed on your computer. As for the ones you want active, you chose among them after bootup. Chris, Start out with a clean system, switch all the FL bits off, and turn off the width tables. Bill, Anyone for 561? 561 and going .... going .... gone! To Bill Rehbock! Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 68 Thu Jul 22, 1993 JIM.K [Jim~ST Sysop] at 12:59 EDT Messages #1-136 have been archived and are in the library-File #29445. SPEEDO_2.ARC 1June93 to 15July93. Jim Kudron 22Jul93 ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 69 Thu Jul 22, 1993 K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 13:32 EDT Hmmmm. Let me put this another way. How much RAM does 50 _active_ fonts use? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 70 Thu Jul 22, 1993 D.MCNAMEE [Dan @ Atari] at 15:47 EST John Nolan, Does your ST have TOS 1.2? Dan Bill, So, when you gonna send some of those up here? The more fonts the better while I'm testing Speedo stuff. ;-) Dan ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 71 Thu Jul 22, 1993 J.NOLAN5 [John Nolan] at 19:54 EDT Dan: no, I'm using a TT with TOS 3.6. I've managed to get SpdGDOS working by bypassing the Install.prg and using the Outline and Driver utilities. Everything appears correct on my disks, but the install won't proceed past a request for "Disk-1", no matter how often I offer it disk-1! ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 72 Thu Jul 22, 1993 ARCHIVIST [Charlie] at 19:56 EDT Kenne, active simply means they can be accessed by GDOS aware programs. You set active and inactive status with the OUTLINE.ACC. When one of your programs uses a GDOS font it's loaded into the cache you set, also with Outline. When your program changes to a new font the cache is flushed and the new font loaded (unless your cache is large enough to hold both fonts). The fonts will only take as much room as you have set in your caches. In other words, 50 active fonts will take the same amount of memory as 1 because the font memory is cached. Someone correct me if I've totaly misunderstood this.... Charlie/sysop ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 73 Thu Jul 22, 1993 K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 20:21 EDT Okay. So far it's like I thought it was. Is there an ANSI font? A font with extended characters? Do the WP fonts have the Atari character set? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 74 Thu Jul 22, 1993 AEO.7 [Gregg] at 21:33 EDT Thanks Chazz, I'll be looking forward to seeing you (and trying those fonts on the shop's Falcon and my own when I finally get the $$$$ together ). Gregg ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 75 Thu Jul 22, 1993 FAIRWEATHER [David] at 22:08 EDT I guess Kenne would like to know how much RAM it would take to have 50 different fonts onscreen in a single document and then printed. I haven't tried 50 at once, but have fit about 10 different simultaneous onscreen fonts comfortably into an 88K character + 88k miscellaneous cache. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 76 Thu Jul 22, 1993 FAIRWEATHER [David] at 22:28 EDT Wow! I've been playing around with my new WP Speedo Fonts from within True Paint. Talk about power! True Paint puts all these fonts at your fingertips in glorious COLOR! Amazing! Now if I only had a color printer . . . ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 77 Thu Jul 22, 1993 J.STANFORD2 [John] at 22:42 EDT You can draw a screen with 100 different fonts using whatever size buffer you currently have. It just might take a while to draw, because as it draws a word in each font it might have to dump the current font and load the new one as it draws. The amount of memory speedo uses is whatever you have configured in your buffers. (There is a recommended minimum though, I don't recall what.) Smaller buffers basically means slower redraws though. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 78 Fri Jul 23, 1993 C.OATES2 [Chris] at 02:45 EDT I increased both my character and Misc, caches to 200k and that fixed my crashing problems. THanks for the advice. ~Chris ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 79 Fri Jul 23, 1993 J.TOWLER1 [John] at 02:54 EDT >K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 20:54 EDT > >The three caches are around 60-50 k each. > >Did someone say "assign.sys?" > >Slowly I turned, step by step, inch by inch.... >---------- Aw c'mon Kenne, ASSIGN.SYS really isn't quite _that_ bad. There's a good explanation of it in "Everything you ever wanted to know about GDOS" (or similar title) by Doug Wheeler. And if you can't stand editing the file manually, you can use the FONTGDOS ACC or CPX to select the fonts you want at each resolution and automatically write out the file. It's pretty simple. I know, 'cause even I can do it. Some of the remarks I hear about ASSIGN.SYS remind me of what I heard about "Font/DA Mover" for the Mac. At first I was reluctant to try it because it was supposed to be so obtuse and awkward. After the first couple of times I did use it, I wondered what I was doing wrong, because it seemed so simple and straightforward. Turned out it actually was simple and straightforward. I think it'll be a while before we get away from some form of involvement with font management. Mac users have to be aware of possible NFNT ID conflicts, and have to use something like Suitcase or Juggler (analogous to G+Plus in a way) to get best use of their fonts and DAs. Suitcase comes with a nice little 122 page manual - the installation instructions end at page 43. Then you begin to put suitcases of fonts and DAs together for your applications. And while I don't know how DOS machines handle Type 1 or TrueType fonts, I wouldn't be surprised if I was told that there was a configuration file of some sort involved. Where I've had grief with GDOS hasn't been with GDOS itself or with ASSIGN.SYS - it's been with programs which use it improperly. But with Speedo now available, hopefully programs will "follow the rules", and if you don't need any bit-maps, ASSIGN.SYS can essentially be an empty file which just lists the screen resolutions. - John ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 80 Fri Jul 23, 1993 K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 02:59 EDT You don't need Font DA Mover with Sys7 or higher. You place fonts in the system folder and they're active. I even think you can drag fonts to the system icon and it will place them in the proper folder for you. I'll look for the FontGDOS ACC. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 81 Fri Jul 23, 1993 COMPO at 03:01 EDT John Nolan - We just received a fixed version of the Installation Program. I'll send you a copy straight away. I'll send you more info in e-mail. Robert ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 82 Fri Jul 23, 1993 D.MCNAMEE [Dan @ Atari] at 17:36 EST Kenne, As much as or little as you assign to the caches. Dan John, Sounds like you may have a bad disk then. I'd suggest you take to your dealer about getting it replaced, or he could probably copy the files onto it again for you. Dan Kenne, There are TONS of characters in each font. All of the Atari character set is represented in each font, except for the hebrew characters. For additional symbols and stuff, though, there is the Symbol and Wingbats character sets. Dan David, I did up a document here while testing where I had the entire ST character set (characters 32 through 255) in all 250+ fonts I have in Works. Does that answer your question? Dan John, Actually, I find the ASSIGN.SYS file pretty scary at times myself. ;-) I've gotten to know it a lot better since I've been doing lots of GDOS testing, but before that I was more than happy to leave it alone. ;-) Dan ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 83 Fri Jul 23, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 19:10 EDT John, When I was at my friends house checking out Speedo, we noticed a file on Disk 1 called SPD1 (I think that was the name). We looked at it and all it had in it was a space and CR/LF. There was SPD2 on disk 2, etc. Check to make sure that file is there as this may be the way the install program knows which disk is the correct one. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 84 Fri Jul 23, 1993 J.NOLAN5 [John Nolan] at 19:37 EDT Wayne: yeah, that little file is there...oh well. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 85 Fri Jul 23, 1993 A.CULLUM1 at 23:49 EDT Hi, I was wondering if someone could answer a couple of questions for me about Speedo? 1) When I've used it with a 24 pin Epson, (lq-750 driver) it goes over each line 3 times, so that each character comes out looking very bold, and even smear as the print head goes by. Have others had this experience with 24 pin printers? Or is it peculiar to my printer? 2) I am considering a Canon BJ200 as a replacement ($50 rebate right now, so I can get one for about $285). It uses the BJ10 driver, but has a paper tray (looks like a Stylewriter). Is it possible to get a modified driver that would support the tray, as the Speedo one only allows for manual feed? 3) Applications that use Gdos take a minute or two longer to load now, which from what I can tell is not normal. Is there any noticable slow up on other's (i.e. your) systems? 4) Warp 9's screen acceleration causes the machine to bomb after printing on my system, as well as my friend's. Is this a known problem? I'm running ver. 3.73 of Warp 9, is there a 3.74 out? Well, I think that's enough pestering for one post. Any info would be appreciated. Thanks, Andrew Cullum (A.CULLUM1) ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 86 Sat Jul 24, 1993 J.TOWLER1 [John] at 03:23 EDT >K.ESTES [Kenne@SFRT] at 02:59 EDT > >You don't need Font DA Mover with Sys7 or higher. You place fonts in the >system folder and they're active. I even think you can drag fonts to the >system icon and it will place them in the proper folder for you. > You're right. I'm still using System 6 with a Spectre GCR cartridge, and FontDA Mover is still necessary for anything pre-System 7. - John ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 87 Sat Jul 24, 1993 M.POCHE [Mick] at 05:47 EDT A.CULLUM1, To answer question: My experience with 24 pin printers and SpeedoGDOS is about zero, but I suspect that it is behaving properly when it prints each line in several passes. The reason it does this (I think) is that between each pass of the print head, the paper is advanced just a tiny bit. This makes the characters print a bit smoother (eliminates some of the 'jaggies'). PageStream did this on my old 9-pin Star printer. Slow, but it worked. #3: When you say GDOS applications take a minute or two longer to load, are you being literal? There should be some delay while the program loads up the installed fonts, but not more than a few seconds (from a hard drive that is!). #4: The Codeheads and Atari are both aware of the conflict between Warp 9 and printing with SpeedoGDOS. Turning off the acceleration in W9 should do the trick until W9 is updated. Warp 9 in currently up to version 3.75. You can upgrade all the way up from your current version by downloading the patches available here in the library. Hope that helps you a little bit, but I'm sure others will offer even more (better?) assistance. - Mick ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 88 Sat Jul 24, 1993 M.ERSOFF at 09:36 EDT A.CULLUM, Concerning your #2 question about the Canon BJ-200 and auto feed. I have a BJ-200 and Speedo works GREAT with it .. I really just use Atari's new program called WORKS with Speedo GDOS and everything works fine with the BJ10e driver and my BJ-200 printer. Fantastic output .... If you have any other questions let me know .... Mayer Ersoff ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 89 Sat Jul 24, 1993 A.CULLUM1 at 11:23 EDT Thanks for the quick responses Mick and Mayer. My old 9 pin used to go over lines twice to make the print look better, but the 24 pin usually doesn't (I think), and I've never seen one go over the line 3 times. Makes for quite slow printing, as well as thick characters. Anything over about 24 point looks fine (correct thickness and darkness), so it seems like Speedo will only let the printer do so thin of lines. I'll try and check the exact time for fonts to load, but it is more than a few seconds (probably between 30 seconds and a minute) I suppose in the long run, its not that much time, but it can be frustrating when you are in a hurry. Thanks again, Andrew ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 90 Sat Jul 24, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 11:44 EDT Wayne, Those are the disk labels. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 91 Sat Jul 24, 1993 MIKE-ALLEN [NM~SysOp] at 14:06 EDT Andrew, I am using a BJ-300 with Speedo and AtariWorks with the BJ10 driver. The BJ- 300 uses fan-fold paper. Although the driver, when accessed from the acc, only says "manual" feed, when you go to the print option in AW, it gives you the manual or automatic options. For me, at least, the automatic option from AW works fine. The only other GDOS program that I use with regularity (XICPrint) also does an automatic feed with the Speedo BJ10 driver. Warp9 is up to version 3.75. File 26900 (W9_374UP.LZH) will update 3.73 to 3.74. File 26927 (W9_375UP.LZH) will bring 3.74 up to 3.75. There is a known conflict between Speedo and Warp9. It will bomb during print. You can either turn turn Warp9 acceleration off during Speedo applications, (using the WARP9.DAT file) or just turn it off prior to printing using the Warp9 control panel. Mike Allen ST HelpDesk~SysOp ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 92 Sat Jul 24, 1993 ORA [Bob] at 20:10 EDT I suggest you either talk to the manager of the store, or if you really wnat to bug somebody, write to the customer service dept of their headquarters. there is no reason for us to be treated as inferior just because we choose an 'alternative' computer system Get 'em Veg ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 93 Sun Jul 25, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 03:24 EDT The driver with Calligrapher makes four passes on a 9-pin Epson (if you choose it). The driver in another program, for the PC, makes eight passes on the same printer. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 94 Sun Jul 25, 1993 A.CULLUM1 at 03:37 EDT Hi, someone discovered why it was taking so long to load the fonts: I had font widths on. Once I turned that off it only took a few seconds to load the fonts (although Word Up still seems slow with fonts, but Word Up has always been a little odd). Thanks to all those who offered help. Andrew (By the way, I got the BJ200, and it looks pretty nice. Quiet too.) ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 95 Sun Jul 25, 1993 M.MARKS1 [Michael] at 15:18 EDT I'm trying to install SpeedoGDOS and AtariWorks on my Supra 20meg drive and my Mega4 with 1.2 ROMs. But it's not working. I can complete the procedure to install AtariWorks, but then when I run it, it bombs during the loading. I can't get very far in the procedure to install SpeedoGDOS at all. I double-click on the installation program, it begins to load, an empty grey box appears on the screen with the expected "x" in the upper left-hand corner, and -- nothing! I can move my mouse at this point, but I can't even close the box by clicking on the "x", so I assume the program has hung before loading was complete. I tried a friend's copy of the SpeedoGDOS installation disk to see if my disk might be defective. Same result: hanging with the grey box on the screen. I eliminated all my desk accessories and all AUTO folder programs except FOLDERXXX and DISKFREE. Same result. Is AtariWorks/SpeedoGDOS incompatible with TOS 1.2? What else could be a factor here? Thanks for any help. This is very frustrating. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 96 Sun Jul 25, 1993 M.ERSOFF at 17:02 EDT M.MARKS1, I had the same problem with Atari Works and TOS 1.2 here's the answer... Download the file in the Atari Roundtable called WORSUPD (or something like that)... It seems there was a problem with TOS 1.2 and the dictionary in the original Works 1.2 release. Atari fixed the dictionary so it will now work with TOS 1.2. I use the "fixed" version all the time with Speedo GDOS and I have no problems.... Hope this helps..... Mayer ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 97 Sun Jul 25, 1993 M.ERSOFF at 17:06 EDT M.MARKS1, I just went over to the file section and found the file # you need for the Works update: 29421 WRKSUPDT.TOS X B.REHBOCK 930720 69632 61 2 Desc: Atari Works update for TOS v1.2 Hope this helps ...Mayer ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 98 Sun Jul 25, 1993 B.SALDANA1 [BOB S] at 21:30 EDT I installed Speedo and am getting 4 bombs on bootup then it proceeds to the desktop where I get a few few extra whirs of the hard drive for good measure. I'm running Harlekin II a Diamond Edge Disk Mirror prg. a HiTech Advisors High.Prg and HTAboot.Prg and Icd boot Prg in the Auto folder. Width tables are off and caches are at 50k each. I have all the fonts load at the same time. I have been turning off Outburst Speedup prg in the AUTO folder when not using Pagestream as it seems to confuse Wordperfect and other Wordprocessors printing routines. My question is should I be concerned? Should I ask William Sessions to come out take a look or my local bomb squad? Bob Saldana ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 99 Mon Jul 26, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 21:33 EDT Al, All my checking showed them as normal files. When I pulled up the info on the disk, that filename didn't show up as the disk label. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 100 Mon Jul 26, 1993 J.NOLAN5 [John Nolan] at 21:42 EDT Can anyone fill me in on the method for adding bitmapped fonts to Speedo? Thanks. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 101 Mon Jul 26, 1993 C.S.SMETON [STraight FAX] at 23:13 EDT To: J.NOLAN5, I would recommend against installing bit mapped fonts with Speedo GDOS. The potential font id conflicts will create alot of problems. The font id for bitmapped Swiss is not the same as Speedo Swiss and the font id for bitmapped Dutch is the same as one of the Speedo Dutch fonts. Besides, the quality of bitmapped fonts does not compare to that of Speedo fonts. Charles ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 102 Tue Jul 27, 1993 M.ABDULKAREE [ASX] at 01:06 EDT John Nolan: RE: Adding bitmapped fonts to Speedo: Well, simply copy the fonts *.FNT to the DRIVERS\ folder (or wherever you told Speedo to find the device drivers at.) Then use the Printer Drivers CPX/ACC to activate that font. That is it! Unless you meant converting that bitmapped font to an outline; Speedo kernel handles the outline, there is another part that still does the bitmapped fonts: GDOS. Hence Speedo + GDOS = SpeedoGDOS . The font ids are unique for each font, otherwise it is the font creator's fault for messing up the ids. I have both the bitmapped Swiss, Dutch, Typewriter along with the outline fonts. And I can access both without any problems! On the topic of quality the bitmapped fonts are the best-- only for their resolution--unless they were poorly formed to begin with. Although Speedo does output clean and sharp text. Unfortunately its screen representation is not that optimal as a hand drawn bitmap. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 103 Tue Jul 27, 1993 JLHOFFMAN [John Hoffman] at 02:05 EDT Nolan, I've managed to add bitmap fonts. Basically you modify the assign.sys file as you did with the old version of gdos. I added a couple of mono space fonts for conNect, Gemini and gemterm. Unfortunately none of these environment can see my bitmapped fonts making them kinda useless. They do however appear in Atari Works. If you are using ST Medium Rez, then they are a savior in ST Medium as they are the only fonts that are useable in the spreadsheet. Also contrary to many of the posts here about the quality of the fonts, I think that the onscreen rendition of bitmap fonts on ST Medium Rez are better that the Speedo fonts. I do however agree that that quality of the fonts in High Rez or on my printer are very good. JOhn ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 104 Tue Jul 27, 1993 J.NOLAN5 [John Nolan] at 07:45 EDT Thanks to all for the info: Charles, I'm converting a couple of Type 1's to bitmaps with Bitmaker in order to have some special characters available...to bad there's no Type 1 to Speedo prg! ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 105 Tue Jul 27, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 20:23 EDT Wayne, The ST method of disk labeling and the PC method differ; the Atari shows those labels as files. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 106 Tue Jul 27, 1993 M.BOSSERT at 22:47 EDT I am having the EXACT same problems as M. Marks (see July 25, message 95) I'm using an ST Mega 2. I've used the WRKSUPDT.TOS fix for TOS 1.2, so now AW runs, altho it tends to crash alot. However, speedoGDOS just locks up after I try to install it. A gray box comes up that says Atari Font Installation, then nothing happens. I've turned off acc., turned off other GDOS.PRGs, no luck. HELP! ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 107 Wed Jul 28, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 04:56 EDT Al, Yes, but everytime I have made a disk label, it shows up as a disk label in the Show Information section. Are you saying that the disk were done on a PC? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 108 Wed Jul 28, 1993 B.ANDERSON31 [Bruce] at 19:03 EDT M. Bossert: I received my copies of Atariworks and SpeedoGDOS yesterday and experienced the same problems you did (with the additional problem of a corrupted file in my Atariworks program which renders it useless). Like you, I am running TOS 1.2 After calling my dealer, who agreed to send me a new set of disks and persuaded me to buy TOS 1.4, I played with the SpeedoGDOS files and was able to load them successfully. Here is my set-up. I cannot vouch for its correctness, but it works for me. SPDGDOS.PRG -- Copy to the AUTO folder in drive C ASSIGN -- Main directory, drive C FONTS -- Inside ASSIGN folder EXTEND -- Inside FONTS folder DRIVERS -- Main directory, drive C DRIVERS.ACC -- Main directory, drive C OUTLINE. ACC -- Main directory, drive C Since I do not yet have a good copy of Atariworks to play with, I tried SpeedoGDOS with Word-Up. After a lot of adjusting, I was able to get everything to work OK, but WOW is it slow in changing from one font to another. I hope that this will not be the case with Atariworks, or I will be greatly disappointed. The output is first-rate, though, and comparable to the output using Pagestream and the Compugraphic fonts. 'Hope this helps. HHH ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 109 Wed Jul 28, 1993 M.BOSSERT at 23:37 EDT Bruce Anderson: I tried your suggestions. Now when I boot up, I get the following mmessages: No cache line in extend system Using default Bitmap font cache size = (some number-I didn't get it) Speedo GDOS not enabled GDOS v. 4.1 enabled. Atariworks was printing out VERY small (even at large point sizes) before I tried your suggestions. Now all I get is a bunch of junk - certainly not WYSIWYG. Any ideas? Thanks. Mark Bossert ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 110 Thu Jul 29, 1993 B.ANDERSON31 [Bruce] at 06:50 EDT M. Bossert: Again, I claim no expertise in using SpeedoGDOS, but I think your next step is to use the Outline Fonts desk accessory to set cache settings, which you will find inside "Cache Options." I don't remember now whether mine are set at the default values or if I changed them, but these work with my Mega 2 (and TOS 1.2): Character 106; Mescellaneous 45; Bitmap Font 100. Once you have done that, you must use the other desk accessory, "Outline Fonts," to establish which fonts and point sizes you wish to load into memory. Obviously, the more fonts you designate, the more you tax the memory of your computer. With Word-Up it is also necessary to generate width tables to get proper spacing of text, but that is not supposed to be necessary for Atariworks. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 111 Thu Jul 29, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 08:17 EDT Wayne, Al I know is that labels I make on any PC at the office show up as merely files on my TT or ST. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 112 Thu Jul 29, 1993 PRADIP [Pradip@Works] at 13:16 EDT Bruce The spelling checker overlay (AMERICAN.OVL) file in the release version is not very friendly with TOS1.2. Recently Bill uploaded a fix for this (I forget the name of the file). So please check this file and I am sure you will be all set. About SpeedoGDOS problem. You should put the EXTEND.SYS and ASSIGN.SYS files on the root of C: and you can run OUTLINE.ACC (or APP) to change different settings, like cache etc. M.Bossert Please check your extend.sys file, it should be on the root of C: Also use OUTLINE.ACC to set the cache etc. Pradip ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 113 Thu Jul 29, 1993 D.MCNAMEE [Dan @ Atari] at 15:53 EST If you are installing Speedo by copying files off the disk instead of using the install program, do not use the ASSIGN.SYS or EXTEND.SYS files that are on the disk. The install program modifies certain lines in those files depending on where you tell the install program where to put the fonts and drivers. Just copy the rest of the files to where you want them then run DRIVERS.ACC (Which can be renamed to DRIVERS.PRG and run) to select your printer, etc and create your ASSIGN.SYS, then run OUTLINE.ACC (same as DRIVERS.ACC/PRG) to select your fonts, cache settings, etc and create your EXTEND.SYS. Dan BTW, you can put your fonts and drivers anywhere you want and set the path from the two .ACC/.PRGs. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 114 Thu Jul 29, 1993 JLHOFFMAN [John Hoffman] at 23:12 EDT I think that I've concluded that the problems I'm having using Atari Works are actually problems with Speedo GDOS. I'm having problems with the font effects running on Medium Rez. If I'm using a speedo font and it is bold it draws on screen at just over 2 seconds per character!! So if I have 20 lines of text with and average of 50 characters per line thats (20*50*2)/60 or 33 Minutes to display. Wow, That's slower than I expected. Dare I try this out? It's been explained to me that this problem goes away for fonts that are more then 15 pixels high. I think that this means to do word processing with speedo or use ConNect terminal software I'll be restricted to about 10 lines of text on screen. Please tell me that there is an update just around the corner that fixes this problem and enhances the display of speedo characters on ST Medium Rez. BTW the speed of regular speedo fonts without effects is increadable! Also on my mono screen in high rez the fonts and effects work great. In fact the effect have no noticable slowdown. Thanks, John ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 115 Thu Jul 29, 1993 M.HEBERT1 at 23:35 EDT To all, SpeedoGDOS is great!!! Atariworks is very, very good!!! But....I can't get good old Timeworks 1 to run with Speedo. I have tried turning bitmaps on, limiting the number of fonts to only one but it crashes with an "Internal Error 1" message. Do I need to delete all the Speedo Fonts and use only my old bitmap fonts or is it an incompatibility with SpeedoGDOS itself? Would appreciate any help from anyone who has SpeedoGDOS working with Timeworks Publisher. Mike Hebert ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 116 Fri Jul 30, 1993 J.WISNIEWSK2 [Jeff - ST'er] at 00:57 EDT Mike, With TimeWorks Publisher, did you re-run the FONTWID program with SPEEDO installed?. ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ ^^^^ JSW ^^^^ ^^^^ ST'er ^^^^ ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ Friday, July 30, 1993 - 12:48:00 am ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 117 Fri Jul 30, 1993 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 07:26 EDT John, what size are your caches? I haven't seen any such slowdown. gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 118 Fri Jul 30, 1993 F-D-PERCIVAL [Fred P.] at 07:44 EDT John, Why do you use Medium Rez for text when you have a Hi Rez monitor? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 119 Fri Jul 30, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 08:18 EDT Mike, with TimeWorks, you may need to have the width tables turned on. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 120 Fri Jul 30, 1993 FAIRWEATHER [David] at 10:00 EDT John H.-- if you've got a mono screen, why are you still using AW and Speedo in medium rez? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 121 Fri Jul 30, 1993 JLHOFFMAN [John Hoffman] at 23:28 EDT Gnox, My caches were 150K each. I only had the standard speedo fonts installed. To experience VSC (Very Slow Character) mode use ST Medium Rez on a standard ST with TOS 1.4. Now load AW and start a word processing document. Set the font to 12 point swiss. Enter the line: This is a test. Now click on the B in the text formating buttons. Time it. My stop watch says 13.49 seconds. This was for 11 characters. If anyone can do this test and not experience VSC please let me know. I'd love to find out that something in my setup is wrong. Fred & David, Good question. I don't usually. But occasionally when doing something small I don't switch to mono. Usually I use color unless doing DTP type stuff. But a bug is a bug and if nobody says anything it may never get fixed. Certainly if I didn't have a mono monitor I would be very unhappy. John ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 122 Sat Jul 31, 1993 P-DIRECT [Sean@TWP] at 00:22 EDT J.H. It may be more of a "flaw" in the scaler rather than a bug, and having been a programmer in the past there is quite a difference. "Flaw" -- An unintentional attribute of an algolrithm designed for a particular purpose when not given the "expected" parameters. "Bug" -- A undocumented feature of a program that has unpredictable results when given the correct parameters. I would think that the scaler's bolding routines aren't expecting a partcular parameter it is getting from the fact it is in medium resolution. True, it should be fixed...but then again...this is the best GDOS that has come out of Atari's doors period, and even better this is the first "commercial" SpeedoGDOS -- some problems are to be expected. Sean Dougherty Two Worlds Publishing In the words of a President, "If at first you don't succeed, try, try, again." ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 123 Sat Jul 31, 1993 JLHOFFMAN [John Hoffman] at 01:48 EDT Some more details on the bolding bug in the speedo Gdos software in medium rez. Fonts at 17 point or greater size are not affected. Fonts below 17 point size are not being rendered correctly. A 16 point bolded swiss font doesn't look anything like a 17 point bolded swiss font. All other effects are uneffected. This bug only affects bolding. This bug has no effect on bitmap fonts. Bitmap fonts work perfectly. Although I wonder if you can print bitmap fonts. John ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 124 Sat Jul 31, 1993 M.ENGLE1 [Pooh] at 01:53 EDT John: per/VSC. 2meg 1040STE, TOS 1.6, 150k caches, ST Med Rez=12.8 sec. But, I don't care. I have a mono monitor. I have SPEEDO. I have Atari Works (at last). I'm set. All of that aside though, you are right about this being annoying for someone with access only to Med Rez. :| I would be highly dissappointed. The SPEEDO/AW combo has such slick output on screen and to my printer. I would not wish that Med Rez display on my worst enemy. Uuuuuuuugly. But, hey. If you plan on doing any _serious_ time with text, using Med Rez with any package is comparable to watching letterbox format movies on a 4" display. Ouch. POOH ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 125 Sat Jul 31, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 08:44 EDT John, Just out of curiosity, are you using Warp 9? Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 126 Sat Jul 31, 1993 P-DIRECT [Sean@TWP] at 11:05 EDT Well, after a little bit of testing I've come to a startling conclusion. Bold slows down to same "slow draw" on text sizes smaller than 6 point in 640x480 or similar modes. And as an interesting observation, it appears that bolding takes longer at the point when the characters on the screen become small enough so that parts of it end up connected (eg. The hollow part on the top of the "e" is gone). Thus, the best way to stop the insanity of waiting is to either to use the already bolded fonts (which look better anyways), or to use 640x400> Sean Dougherty Two Worlds Publishing ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 127 Sat Jul 31, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 11:29 EDT I switched over to color and did some testing. I trie dit in different speed settings and such. I did find a big difference but, I found it by switching the BLITTER on and off. With the BLITTER off, the text speed in Bold was the same as in Normal. However, the text looked the same in Bold as it did in Normal. You couldn't tell the two different types apart. With the BLITTER on, I did see the big difference in speed, 6 sec. in 16mhz cache and 12 sec. in 8mhz mode using 'This is a test'. The text looked different also. So, the BLITTER seems to play a big part in this thing. 12 point font on the color monitor was pretty much unreadable. I can't see how anyone would choose to use AW on a color monitor over a mono monitor. I can understand if that is all you got but, if you have a mono, use it. It will not give you a headache. I couldn't stand even the small amount of time I spent in AW testing it out on the color monitor. YUCK!!! It looked aweful!!! Also, different fonts have a different point size that is slow. For instance, with Swiss 721, I had to go to 18 points in order to get rid of the slow speed. In Monospaced 821, it was 13 points and in Pica 10 pitch, it was 24 points. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 128 Sat Jul 31, 1993 JLHOFFMAN [John Hoffman] at 18:09 EDT Sean, I agree with your description. I do think that it is an error in the algorithm for scaling. I even think that it might have to do with integer math and small number when roundoff errors cause perhaps 0 results when fractional parts might be significant. I also think that this product is an excellent gdos provided you can work around this problem. There in lies the hitch. Using AW in spreadsheet mode all the indexes are in bold. So if you don't have the luxury as I do of having a mono monitor and you only use ST medium as I'm sure many people do, this problem can make the spreadsheet functionality of AW useable with only great effort. So I really hope to hear that there will be a fix soon. Then speedo GDOS really will be the GREAT product it should be. John ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 129 Sat Jul 31, 1993 JLHOFFMAN [John Hoffman] at 18:58 EDT Ken Van, Yes I have warp 9. Although when I run AW I have it turned off. This is because of the print conflict between speedo printing and Warp 9. So my warp9.dat contains the a0 option for AW. Wayne, Great job debugging this. You are indeed correct. If you turn the blitter off the bolded fonts look the same as the nonbolded fonts they also display just as fast. When you print the fonts they print bold as they should. Hopefully this information can help Atari fix this Flaw. BTW I did notice another potential for problems. Even though after you select bold and everything looks fine there is still a problem. The positioning on the bolded text isn't correct. I'll put it to you this way. If I print 80 characters in nonbold 12 point font, then I print the same line right below the original line in bold both lines look the same. If I print this to the printer, the bolded line is longer. So the problem is that if I have a paragraph that is bolded the right margin is off. This point asside the spreadsheet option of AW is now workable on a color display. John ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 130 Sun Aug 01, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 00:11 EDT John, Well, I guess Warp 9 can't help you then. Shucks! Ken ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 131 Sun Aug 01, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 07:09 EDT Sean, if only AW would know enough to use the bold version of the font instead of bolding the font when you choose bold; MicroSlop Works does this, as does Callig for the Atari. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 132 Sun Aug 01, 1993 JLHOFFMAN [John Hoffman] at 15:52 EDT Al, You know Speedo does do an excellent job at creating the various effects that it provides. In fact if it weren't for problems mentioned earlier I'd think that there wouldn't be much need for the versions of the font with effects. Just takes of disk space. Also I may be wrong but I think that this is the approach taken by MS with true type fonts. This approach provides better flexibility. Now all those fonts I have can be used with all the effects. John ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 133 Sun Aug 01, 1993 R.BEATTY3 [Buffalo Bob] at 17:47 EDT Bruce, Word Up was (is) dreadfully slow anytime you try to use it with a normal GDOS. Neocept's proprietary method of handling of fonts pretty much ignored GDOS. I was able to use FSM w/ Word Up to some extent, but the speed was really bad. Atari Works and WordFlair both work exceptionally well w/ Speedo. M.Bossert: Set the bitmap cache to 0 if you are not adding any bitmap (old-style) fonts to SpeedoGDOS. Bob Beatty @ Neutronics Honolulu, HI ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 134 Sun Aug 01, 1993 R.BEATTY3 [Buffalo Bob] at 17:54 EDT John, The effects may be less noticeable with a bold font, but an italicized font is completely different from a non-italicized version. Look closely at the differences in AW and you'll see what I mean. Bob Beatty @ Neutronics Honolulu, HI ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 135 Sun Aug 01, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 18:04 EDT I think we're going to have to be clearer with the abbreviations, Al. AW could mean Atari Writer or Atari Works. I guess someone would know which from the thread in this case. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 136 Sun Aug 01, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 21:46 EDT If I remember correctly, someone was saying that you can use regular Bitstream fonts in SpeedoGDOS. If this is true, what is the EXT for the filenames on the IBM or whatever? The filenames I have end in SPD. A friend of mine was wanting to know as he has some Bitstream fonts that came with an IBM package that he wants to use when he gets AtariWorks. The only problem is that the program evedently put them into his Windows system directory and just about all of his fonts have the .FON extension. Thanks. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 137 Mon Aug 02, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 03:26 EDT TrueType fonts are a little cleverer in some ways, John, but the Speedo scaling engine is better. I've run a lot of tests -- we are buying a newspaper pagination upgrade that uses Speedo fonts, so this is serious stuff -- and Speedo's effects in bolding and so on are not as good in any way as the use of the separate Speedo bold (etc.) faces. If they look good to you, you *can* save time by using them. But, then again, creating an fkey that switches to a bold Speedo font is just as fast when you just press F2 and so on. Ken, Yes, you're right. But it would not only be the thread that would give it away, but the RoundTable, too; AtariWriter only runs on the 8-bits. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 138 Mon Aug 02, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 07:33 EDT Wayne, The fonts in the 50-font WP package have .SPD _and_ .TDF extensions. I don't know what the .TDFs are for. Bitstream also releases these fonts in a True- Type version, and I don't know what extension they have then. Al, Oh! I hear about a lot of word processors here that I don't use. I thought there was an ST version of Writer. It seemed as though people were talking about it. Must be something with a similar name. :^) Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 139 Mon Aug 02, 1993 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 07:37 EDT Wayne, Bitstream distributes fonts in several formats, but I believe only SPD will work with SpeedoGDOS. By the way, Compo sells some font sets that include both the Speedo and the Type 1 versions of the Bitstream fonts. Very useful for those who want to have the same font available in both Atari Works and Pagestream. I bought one set and am very pleased with it. gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 140 Mon Aug 02, 1993 TOWNS [John] at 14:00 EDT One solution to the problem of slow algorithmic effects is to use the Bold versions of Speedo fonts that come with the various font families. You get much better bolded and italic fonts from them anyway. Unless something has changed, the way it works is that SpeedoGDOS will generate a character and then the VDI will bold it algorithmically. This isn't exactly fast (as you can see) ;-) When you pick a Bold font from the Speedo font family, the Speedo scaler will produce a real bold font and it does it from the scaler. The VDI doesn't have to do any effects after the fact. -- John ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 141 Mon Aug 02, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 17:04 EDT Wayne, No, no, no. BitStream's Speedo fonts work fine with Speedo GDOS, but BitStream has other fonts that will not. Only fonts that have an SPD extension will work. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 142 Mon Aug 02, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 18:03 EDT Ken, Two wet-noodle lashes if you don't know about ST Writer, the world's greatest free word processor. It is an outgrowth of Atari Writer. TDF = Typeface Definition File. They are ASCII files; take a look. Towns, Hi! You said it well. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 143 Mon Aug 02, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 21:44 EDT Al, Hold that noodle! I know about ST Writer, but wasn't aware of its ancestry. So what's TDF good for? Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 144 Mon Aug 02, 1993 JLHOFFMAN [John Hoffman] at 23:45 EDT Towns, Al, Yep I think that everyone will agree that using the speedo fonts which implement the effects is going to product better overall output. Also I've programmed some of these effects into a function key using AW, which is a wonderful product for the money. I did go and print out several font both with the speedo effects and with the generated effects. Particularly in the italics the speedo font effects were far nicer. But there are instances using applications where you have NO choice but to use the effects. Consider AW, if you would like to use the spreadsheet you are stuck with bold fonts. Now we're talking a minimum of 25 seconds to page down and 3 seconds to scroll one column. These numbers are in an empty spreadsheet. Also there are other applications like connect and stalker that support gdos fonts. Terminal applications might inflict bold on the use. I also have trouble understanding why VDI would have trouble bolding a speedo font but not a bitmap font. Even more significantly why is it slow with the blitter on and nonfunctional with the blitter off. Oh Well. I've beat this to death. I just hope that Atari notes these for a future release if ever... ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 145 Tue Aug 03, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 07:57 EDT TDF is used by the scaler and by the part of the setup that provides equivalents for fonts. (Not sure of the Atari implementation makes good use of that, though.) Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 146 Tue Aug 03, 1993 K.VANDELLEN [Ken Van] at 20:36 EDT Thanks, Al. I hope someone can tell us whether we need the TDFs installed. Ken Van ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 147 Wed Aug 04, 1993 J.KRZYSZTOW [JEFFREY] at 00:04 EDT I currently have 4.1 of SpeedoGDOS. At the MIST Show, I saw alot of 4.11 versions. What is the difference and how do I get updates? Jeffrey A. Krzysztow ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 148 Fri Aug 06, 1993 P-DIRECT [Sean@TWP] at 23:00 EDT I've noticed the LaserJet driver likes to offset things ALOT on the HP III and the HP 4. Not only that, but printing takes ages at 300dpi. To top all of this off, to make copies it sends the page over again! In order to avoid a half hour printing session, I just use the "copies" selection on the HP 4...but it is still annoying. Sean Dougherty Two Worlds Publishing ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 149 Sat Aug 07, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 00:03 EDT Sean, That is strange as a friend of mine has the HP III and his pages print out faster than Calamus prints out stuff. He said it was fast. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 150 Sat Aug 07, 1993 R.GREIN [Randy Grein] at 22:15 EDT Hi! I'm not sure if you've solved your problem wit the SpeedoGDOS installation yet, but I had the same problem. It seems to be a TOS 1.2 issue, similar to the one that Works has. (There are other postings with the fix for that.) Just copy the relavant files to their appropriate areas from the 3 disks, and away you go! BTW, I'm currently having the same difficulty with MultiTOS, which I just returned from a trip to my favorite Atari shop (Xanth) with. The same fix should work, but I hope this problem gets fixed - I'm used to fixing supposedly unfixable configuration problems; there's a lot of people out there who aren't so lucky and don't have a Genie account! ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 151 Sat Aug 07, 1993 DABRUMLEVE [kidprgs] at 23:01 EDT A couple of my customers have TOS 1.2 Megas. The installation program for SpeedoGDOS hung. I installed their copies using an STe hooked up to their hard drives for them. This is a +lot+ easier than trying to figure out the proper setup, since the manual doesn't explain it. Anyway, I'd highly recommend that 1.2 users seek out a fellow Atarian with a different TOS version or ask their dealers to install it. The installation program is simplicity itself -- as long as the computer it's running on is compatible with it. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 152 Sun Aug 08, 1993 L.HINSLEY [Stargazer] at 12:14 EDT Hi Everyone!!! I just received my copies of AtariWorks and SpeedoGDOS and am loving them. My question is about Warp 9 and SpeedoGDOS. I know that AtariWorks will abort during printing if Warp 9 is active, but the problem I am having is with the Warp 9 control panel. If I boot up with SpeedoGDOS active, the procedure will go fine until it gets to loading the Warp 9 control panel and the process hangs. If I boot with Warp 9 in the auto folder but the control panel disabled the machine will boot up. I have went thru and made sure that the FastLoad bits were turned off for everything. Any ideas??? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 153 Sun Aug 08, 1993 J.EIDSVOOG1 [CodeHead] at 14:33 EDT Stargazer, See my response to your Warp 9 problems in topic 31, Category 32. The Warp 9 Control Panel does a lot of things, including loading Extend-O-Save modules. John ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 154 Sun Aug 08, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 22:50 EDT StarG, Haven't seen that problem. Try changing the order in which the programs are loading in the auto folder. And configure the Warp 9 CP (without Speedo) so that all its settings are turned off (no font, no accel, no screen saver, etc.) and then try again. Once it gets running OK again, you can reset the settings. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 155 Mon Aug 09, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 06:11 EDT Whoever it was that said that it took a long time for their stuff to print out using Speedo/AtariWorks, check on page 15 of the Speedo manual under Cache Information. This may explain your problem. Now, how do I get bitmap fonts to show up. I have the bitmap cache set high enough to load the fonts. I put the name of the font in the ASSIGN.SYS file and in the EXTEND.SYS file and still cannot get it to show up. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 156 Mon Aug 09, 1993 O-ZONE [Flakes] at 08:06 EDT My laser printer is a Panasonic KX-P4410 which emulates an HP Laserjet IIP. Where can I get Speedo GDOS driver to match my machine? I currently use HPL300.SYS which I got with Calligrapher 3 but it doesn't work with Speedo GDOS. I tried LASERJET.SYS but it prints in the wrong size and doesn't do a form feed. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 157 Tue Aug 10, 1993 L.HINSLEY [Stargazer] at 20:55 EDT Al, The problem turned out to be at EOS module I was currently using. I removed the module (WARP) and now the computer boots fine with both Speedo and the Warp 9 control panel enabled. Other modules don't seem to cause the problem. ***** Stargazer ***** ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 158 Tue Aug 10, 1993 C.S.SMETON [STraight FAX] at 22:25 EDT Speedo GDOS users should check their master disks for a potential virus that somehow may have leaked on to the distribution disks. I have heard this from two different sources, so it is better to be safe than sorry when it comes to a computer virus. Charles ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 159 Wed Aug 11, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 08:50 EDT StarG, Thanks for the report. Nice to know Warp9 CP is working ok now. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 160 Wed Aug 11, 1993 FAIRWEATHER [David] at 09:14 EDT What kind of virus? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 161 Wed Aug 11, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 16:37 EDT *** Virus Alert *** I just checked my SpeedoGDOS disk for a virus with VKILLER. It found the KEY virus on disk #3. VKiller says "The 'KEY', 'Signum/BPL' or 'Type 1' Virus at the top of the screen. My disk serial number is 10392. This was the SpeedoGDOS disk that came in my AtariWorks package. VKiller says that it will overwrite the bootsectors on a disk. Luckily I keep a disk with NOROACH in th drive all the time and it is write protected. I will have to check some more disk and see if it spread to those. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 162 Wed Aug 11, 1993 C.OATES2 [Chris] at 22:02 EDT I am assuming only that Atari Speedo disks are at risk? I've got the COMPO package. ~Chris ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 163 Wed Aug 11, 1993 AEO.7 [Gregg] at 23:26 EDT As I understand it, only the 720K version has this virus and only one one of the disks... Still, it would be safest if ALL disks were to be checked before use for the time being. Don't think this is a first though..... I've seen several commerical programs come out with virus' on them.... Jet and Heros of the Lance for example had one (a VERY long time ago). Gregg ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 164 Thu Aug 12, 1993 K.RICHARD2 [Bondservant] at 02:09 EDT Hey Wayne I know I've been known to misplace a dick but I've looked for a week and I don't seem to have a disk 3 for speedos for my Falcon can you tell me what files are on it so I can see if I am missing it?(he says wonderingly Rick ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 165 Thu Aug 12, 1993 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 02:45 EDT Yep, my disk #3 of the Speedo that came with Atari Works also had the Key virus on it. This is the first time I've had a virus in 7 years of using ST/Mega/TTs - and it came directly from Atari! Ironic, no? I couldn't find any other disks with the key virus but a couple were `questionable', so I killed their bootsectors. Every one of the high density disks I've tried appeared to VKiller to have a `corrupted bootsector' ... anybody know if this is normal? I'll have to read the docs to VKiller again - it's been so long! gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 166 Thu Aug 12, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 18:40 EDT I checked all 6 of my disk and only the Disk 3 of the SpeedoGDOS disk had the virus. Like Gregg said, you may still want to check all of them. Rick, you may have the 1.44 meg version of the programs. Mine were on 720K disk. Check your disk size and see. My disk 3 only has a FONTS folder and a file called DISK-3. Some of the fonts are... AI0011.TDF AJ0012.TDF AK0013.TDF AL0014.TDF .......... BX000011.SPD ......12.SPD ......13.SPD ......14.SPD ............ Gnox, Same here. I have never gotten one before. It disn't really come from Atari unless their Master Disks had it on them. It more than likely came from the disk duplicators. That is where they usually get it at. My HDD disk also had what VKiller thought of as corrupted bootsectors. It's probably because of them being HDD since Ataris didn't have HDD disk back then and all and he wasn't checking for them. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 167 Thu Aug 12, 1993 O-ZONE [Flakes] at 18:49 EDT FWIW I also looked at my 2, (should there be 3?) SpeedoGDOS discs using VKILLER and got the "corrupted boot sector" message but no apparent viruses were detected. Disc 1 says "Rev. B" and disc 2 says "Rev. A." I think I'll see what Diamond Edge has to make of it all. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 168 Thu Aug 12, 1993 AEO.7 [Gregg] at 21:06 EDT The famious Virus Killer will give you 'corrupted header' on ALL 1.44 Meg floppys.... Ignore that . However, do NOT use VKiller to alter ANY HighDensity disks... I wouldn't trust it not to mess something up on a format it was never designed to recognise. It should, however, report any known virus on the HD disk if there is one. Gregg ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 169 Thu Aug 12, 1993 K.BROOKS1 [Horizon] at 21:46 EDT *************** * VIRUS CONFIRMED * *************** My Speedo disk #3 (Serial #10389) contains the same Type 1 Virus as was mentioned here yesterday. Watch out! I take it this viral infection is only dangerous if one boots with the darn disk in the drive. Simply copying the font files off into your Speedo folder will not copy the virus boot sectors. Hopefully that's correct! Where did this come from anyway??????? Keith New Horizon ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 170 Fri Aug 13, 1993 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 07:36 EDT Thanks, Gregg and Keith, for the info about VKiller/HD disks and about the way the virus spreads; this explains everything I've seen on my system. (I always boot with the same disk and it's write-protected, so nothing else got infected.) gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 171 Sat Aug 14, 1993 R.KASSOF [Ron] at 09:18 EDT HELP! I just got speedogdos & AtariWorks and I'm having trouble with the fonts. When I print out to my HPLJ II compat. printer (from WordFlair II and AW) some letters and numbers have vert. or horiz slashes through them. This happens mostly with the Dutch font - in fact the capital C even has a horiz slash thru it ON SCREEN! It would appear that the problem lies in the font files themselves, probably not in the printer driver, and definitely not in the printer. The problem is rather consistent and even appears when printing in landscape as well as portrait. I'm using TT med rez (TOS 3.05) by the way - with and without OutBurst 3.0 I've even tried without DA's, CPX's, AUTOprg's, etc. but to no avail. Has anyone heard of this sort of problem? Is there a fix? Thanks Ron ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 172 Sun Aug 15, 1993 R.WELTER2 at 15:06 EDT Well, I just finished installing plain old G-DOS. What a chore! Still not sure if it's right! And, if I add any fonts, from what I can see, I have to add them to ASSIGN.SYS. What a pain in the neck. Anyway, I have a question. What do the different versions of G-DOS do differently? There seem to be four now, did things get any easier? Could someone post a short "history of GDOS" for me? Thanks RIch ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 173 Sun Aug 15, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 19:53 EDT Rich, This is a plain and simple history of GDOS: Digital Research developed the Graphics Environment Manager, GEM, for both the Atari ST and for all PCs in '84 and '85. One of the components of the operating system that was planned from the beginning was a device-independent graphics manager, one that would work just as well drawing to the screen, to a dot-matrix printer, to a plotter, or to a laser printer, among other devices. The idea was simple: Create something that the user did not have to worry about that would let any application -- Microsoft Write, for example, one of the earliest GDOS apps -- create fonts and graphics on-screen that would also print out on any device. As we'll see in a bit, the idea of simplicity had a large problem. This piece of the OS, called the Graphical Device Operating System, did not make it into the ROMs (the code within the computer), so it was distributed separately with applications that used it. Thus GDOS 1.0 was born. It was buggy, and was followed quickly by GDOS 1.1. Competing GDOS software soon came from Germany (AMC GDOS, for example) and from the U.S. (CodeHead's G+Plus GDOS). The best was G+Plus, which managed to keep the computer from slowing down the way Atari's official GDOS did. Also from Germany came another GDOS variant, called NVDI. The fact that "GDOS" isn't in the name anywhere is an indication that NVDI is not just a replacement GDOS - it's a replacement VDI (Virtual Device Interface) *and* GDOS -- but NVDI did handle all GDOS chores. (Let me point out that the past tense here is just for the historical sense. All these programs are still around, and still used.) Atari knew that its original GDOS needed to be updated to handle a new kind of font technology that was catching on in other platforms. Normal GDOS fonts are all bit-mapped; that is, they put bits (dots) in specific places to create characters according to a map of each character, and that map can't be changed. So a 12-pt "A" can't be made into a 14-pt "A" without a degradation of font quality, since the same map must be used. (In fact, in most cases the 12-pt "A" can't be enlarged except to twice or three times its nominal size anyway, and even then it looks terrible.) Apart from the problem of resizing a single font was the difficulty of having enough fonts for all situations. In a bit-mapped font, you need separate font files for each size you are going to use -- one file for 12-pt characters, one for 14, one for 18, and so on. Some users like me collected hundreds of GDOS fonts just to be able to have enough for any printing job. So Atari wanted a new GDOS that handled font scaling. Fonts that can be scaled are able to assume any size, and that means a single font file can substitute for all the bit-mapped files. A scalable font's 12-pt "A" can also be a 14-pt "A" or a 13-pt "A," for that matter. So Atari introduced, sort of, FSM-GDOS -- Font Scaling Module GDOS -- sort of. FSM never really came out for public use; instead, apparently because FSM was developed by a third-party company, that company was the only software manufacturer to offer FSM with its product. FSM should have received wide distribution, but it didn't. It was a nice GDOS. Chagrinned and chastened, Atari rolled out a lesser brother of FSM called Font GDOS. It used bit-mapped fonts and was free to anyone who wanted it. It had the world's most incredibly difficult installation procedure, and to my knowldge there are only two people left on earth who use it. :) But FSM didn't go all the way. A truly modern scalable font is also a hinted font, meaning a font that reshapes its characters for legibility and overall looks based on the point size currently being used. A hinted "q" will have thicker lines (in proportion) at a small size than at a large size, for example. So that's where Speedo GDOS comes from -- the need for a fully scalable, hinted font manager. The "GDOS" in the name is clear, but the "Speedo" comes from the inventor of the Speedo system, BitStream. BitStream is the most respected developer of computer-imaging fonts in Europe, and, until MicroSoft's TrueType came along, held the top position in the technology of properly hinted fonts. (All things considered, TrueType has better hinting, while Speedo is faster at doing the hinting, so it's a toss-up.) Atari scored a bullseye with Speedo. It's the single best move Atari has made in years, and, unlike many other Atari introductions, Speedo GDOS has almost no drawbacks. Speedo fonts are easy to obtain (they're not in every grocery store, but can be found in software stores and can be bought by mail); BitStream is very strong in this country (and is on GEnie, too); printer drivers are already available for many printers and should proliferate in the next few months; Speedo works on all Ataris, from the first ST to the Stacy, to the Book, to the TT, to the Falcon. And it looks gorgeous. Al (I teach computer pagination among a few other things that I do....) ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 174 Sun Aug 15, 1993 R.WATSON15 [Wayne Watson] at 21:36 EDT Rich, With SpeedoGDOS, things are a breeze to setup. I love this version of GDOS. Changing printer drivers, adding fonts, etc. is very simple. You have no need to even touch the ASSIGN.SYS, etc. unless of course you want to add regular GDOS fonts. After playing with GDOS for about 6 months, I never went back to it until SpeedoGDOS came along. That was about 5 years without GDOS. I think you would really like SpeedoGDOS. It uses the Outline fonts which are very nice. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 175 Mon Aug 16, 1993 G.FUHRMAN [gnox] at 07:26 EDT Rich, Thanks for asking that question and prompting another masterpiece from Al. :) Indeed, Speedo GDOS is a real winner. And I say this as one who steadfastly refused to use _any_ GDOS for 6 years. gnox ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 176 Mon Aug 16, 1993 J.NESS [Jim] at 13:41 EDT Al - Thanks for the informative font history. On my PC, I have both Windows and Word Perfect v6 for DOS. So, I get to compare True Type output and Speedo output. Personally, I can't tell the difference, quality-wise. -JN ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 177 Mon Aug 16, 1993 R.WELTER2 at 20:19 EDT Thanks, Al, and everyone for the replies. The whole thing came up because I just bought my harddrive, (I love it) and had GDOS lieing around. At the moment I don't really NEED it, buit I like to play. Sometimes. But after playing with GDOS for a while, I wondered about the others. Sounds like it wouldn't be worth downloading FONTGDOS to play with, more of a pain than the original. I'll just wait till I need a GDOS version, or buy ATARIWORKS. Rich ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 178 Mon Aug 16, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 23:23 EDT Jim Ness, The quality is, indeed, very close. Some of the TT fonts are first-rate, the equal of any Speedos, but, on the other hand, I have seen no Speedo fonts that aren't exceptionally good, while there are a lot of (PD) TT fonts that just aren't done well. Al ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 179 Tue Aug 17, 1993 M.GARRISON1 [Lazarus] at 21:43 EDT Does anyone know which printer driver to use with a Citizen GSX 140 plus 24 pin printer? The only one that seems to work at all is FX80.SYS. I use a LQ 2550 driver with PageStream. Is there a compatable driver for SPEEDO? ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 180 Wed Aug 18, 1993 M.ABDULKAREE [ASX] at 02:17 EDT Al.. you should do an article. Pretty soon you might start seeing people using Speedo fonts throuhout their programs. Maybe even requiring its presence (and I'm not talking about WP or DTP programs!) ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 181 Wed Aug 18, 1993 F-D-PERCIVAL [Fred P.] at 06:59 EDT I discovered that I get better margin control on my DeskJet+ with the Speedo driver if I turn the Perf Skip OFF. This lets me print as close to the top of the sheet as possible. I still need to define at least a .17" Top Margin, or that much of the print gets chopped off. ------------ Category 14, Topic 35 Message 182 Wed Aug 18, 1993 A.FASOLDT [Al Fasoldt] at 07:59 EDT ASX, Thanks. BTW, Geneva makes good use of Speedo fonts in is hypertext help system. Al ------------